On ROH on SBG :
Kori : Is it my imagination, or was everyone wrestling slower this last week?
On WWE TLC 2011 :
Rodney : Triple H vs. Kevin Nash!???? Daniel Bryan is the champ? WTF is going on !!!
On UFC adding a Flyweight division :
Amirah : So excited to see them finally doing this, and to see Ian McCall (WEC
guy who has been tearing it up outside the UFC since he dropped to
flyweight) in that upcoming tournament.
On ROH Glory By Honor X :
Kori : Eddie's match was amazing
On UFC 140 :
Amirah : Patrick/Ebersole - not the most incredible fight, but Ebersole has had a
really notable year, going from random nobody that filled in on
extremely short notice for injured Carlos Condit to a guy with a 3 fight
winning streak in UFC. He's a guy
to watch in the coming year.
On Bellator not being able to go on Spike TV due to Spike owning the broadcast rights to UFC through 2012 :
Rodney : Hahah very interesting. I pretty much have been hearing the same when it comes to Bellator moving to Spike, that it’s just a matter of time. But wow. If UFC doesn’t buy the library then Bellator is pretty much at a stalemate and pretty much derails all talk of them being on a bigger platform. But I don’t think that Spike airing UFC at the same time as Fox will confuse as many people as they think, maybe as far as the actual FOX events. The same casual people who’ll be watching Fox typically won’t be watching Spike on a Saturday night. BUT by us FX and Spike are back to back channels so that could fuck with people’s heads too which isn’t good for anyone. It could also work the reverse way as it’s giving UFC double the exposure and people could flip back and forth and really get into it.
Eric : So you're saying, essentially, UFC shouldn't fork over money to Spike over "confusion in the marketplace" and "compete with themselves"? I mean, for 1. Not paying for the rights means Spike can't air Bellator, even if they wanted, for over another YEAR, keeping them on MTV2 and not the network that would give them bigger viewership 2. You mean you air an old show on basic cable while we run a new live show on network TV with a bigger audience? And that means we're on two channels at once? Boo hoo, right? ha, I mean, UFC's audience is pretty die hard anyway and I'm sure they know better. It's hardly like when Spike would air a recent but old show against a Strikeforce event. 3. The worst they could do is NOT show UFC at all, which means they still have to wait until 2013 to show Bellator unless UFC buys back the right. I laugh at this guy saying FOX doesn't understand what their contract means, ha. I mean, I was just watching the preview of Bellator's Season 5 or whatever it is on 411mania, but it was embedded from what I'm guessing was Spike's website since there was a Spike watermark in the bottom right corner the entire time...even though it was previewing an MTV2 show. I've heard Bellator's been sending or is going to send their fighters to Impact Wrestling to promote their season on TNA, and their prelims will air on Spike's website before going on the air on MTV2, so yeah, it does seem like a matter of time or they want to go in that direction, but I don't think UFC has to worry. I wouldn't pay for the rights back, personally. To me, I'd take the risk that Spike puts UFC's own old content on against itself. Oh, how horrible, right? ha, I mean, if they create confusion in the marketplace, do they really expect fans to stay watching old content for a year and them sticking with it, not catching on, before segueing in to Bellator? So Spike's really in the bad position, to me - either air old UFC footage to fuck with them, or nothing, heh. I mean, the worst they could do is air UFC against their FOX shows and put Bellator ads on it or during it. Bellator's production is good, they've got a good staff behind the scenes from what I know, and they've got some good fighters, but they don't have any names. They've been signing & signing all these undefeated fighters no one's heard of, why not go after someone with name value? Jens Pulver, Marcus Davis, Bobby Lashley, Andre Arlovski, Kendall Grove, etc. those sort of guys.
On UFC signing with FOX :
Rodney : Wow man this is the shit
that inspires me, deals like this involving the evolution of a sport and
smart passionate people behind it. The fights that will be on Fox are
gonna be huge and I can’t wait to see what they have in store for it. To
think this was once banned from PPV and now it will be on the same
network as The Simpsons and NFL. I’m loving this! I was hoping that at UFC 134 Yushin Okami would come out to the Orient Express theme.
Eric : Well said :) That sentence about Simpsons & NFL made me smile. Did
you watch the press conference? The only thing that bothered me was no
one from the Wrestling Roundtable was there to ask a question. Imagine,
"Hey this is Rodney Leconte from the Wrestling Roundtable & I have a
question for Dana....how, if at all, does Strikeforce factor in to
this? Will there be any sort of cross promotion? Does this affect your
outlook on Strikeforce when the Showtime deal ends?" See, that's a good
question and no one asked at all. SF didn't come up once.
But yeah, it is inspiring!
did watch the press conference, fucking awesome. I had no idea they
were doing this today, you should’ve got a plane ticket to LA and asked
Dana about Strikeforce haha. That is a good question and I’m surprised
nobody brought that up too. But imagine they sign Overeem and he fights
Brock on Fox!! AHHHHHH. Bellator and Spike really need to sit down
because honestly saying it’s gonna be hard to compete against UFC and
Fox is an understatement. I feel like UFC has a whole new life injected
into them and that’s scary. If they put on the same Bellator shows that
aired on MTV2 and MSG then they might as well throw in the towel now.
Eric : Ha, well, yeah, Bellator's gotta fucking move like yesterday to position
themselves somehow. I mean, depending on how Spike feels, they could be
in a good position to capitalize on it by getting some $from Spike
like TNA has and Spike did for UFC years ago. But then again, maybe they
won't be competing directly, and, much like wrestling's boom in the
Monday Night Wars was good for all companies and tons of indies cropped
up because of it, we've seen how SO many indy MMA companies are around
now because of UFC making MMA as big as it has become. Of course, as we
know they stupidly run the same nights, but hey, just Zuffa alone is
putting on so many shows between UFC & SF that there might not be a
free Sat. night anymore! But anyway, what I'm saying is, if UFC gets
even bigger because of the Fox deal(which it just HAS to, heh), maybe
that's not as bad for Bellator as we think because maybe it'll ride the
coattails of people looking for anything MMA. And like I said on the
show, maybe they can get a few of the cast offs with name value with
some more funding from Spike. BUT, I think the tournament format really
works against them in numerous ways(champions in non-title fights
against non-tournament winners, injuries) and maybe you're right &
they have no chance already, heh. Maybe they should just hire us to be
the Fertittas of Bellator ;) ha. I guess, like you said, they might as well throw in the towel now, ha.
Also, here's another great question none of these numbnuts in the "MMA
media" asked throughout the whole day yesterday : Do you think the FOX
deal gets them one step closer to being sanctioned in New York? How
could NYC possibly not regulate a sport featured on Fox like the NFL??
Doesn't this give them the cred. they need??
Rodney : Ha actually someone did ask that questioned about being a step closer to being sanctioned in NY and Dana said that at this point one doesn’t have to do with the other. That one of the major things that’s keeping them from NY is the union involved with the Fertittas’ casinos in Vegas.
But I was listening to an interviewing that Bjorn did that was prob held two days or three days ago before the Fox deal was official. And he was saying how they’re not into matchmaking and if people wanted to see two talented fighters in a fight then it would happen if one wins the tournament and gets through everyone. That’s just fucking ridiculous. Because not only are you risking injury but then that also takes away any interesting matchups with other contenders. And like you said the whole non title match thing is goofy and reminds me of wrestling. The only time UFC would do that is in a catchweight or if someone missed weight. Would people buy a PPV if Manny Pacquiao was in a non title fight?
Hey I understand that he wants the best to fight the best but you have to create interest in fights. It’s not a sports league where people are passionate about certain teams and will cheer and follow them no matter who they face. UGH they really need us to be their Dana White.
Eric : UFC's insane
Rodney : Yeah things have been really nuts with them lately but wow. They’re gonna have a monster 4th quarter this year!
On Chavo's WWE release :
Lawrence : So with Chavo released who is left from the WcW invasion?
Eric : Nobody on camera, Arn & Johnny Ace if you count everyone brought over at all.
Lawrence : That is a tragedy
On why he doesn't watch WWE anymore :
Chris : I'm really tired of seeing the same old thing. They put all of their stock into Cena & Orton and these two are not Hogan/Savage or Austin/Rock. On the rare occasion they try to put a new guy on top they are made to look weak or they are not the central storyline. I'd love to see wrestling make a huge comeback and it only takes one guy or one storyline to jumpstart it but WWE is coasting and TNA is nothing more than a joke at this point.
On the Best of Nitro DVD :
Kori : I'm halfway through disc 1 on the Nitro set. Second week that the NWO
exists, they left HWWDNSO in! You can't miss him, mullet and everything,
being body slammed in front of Dean! So far I'm liking the first disc,
they left in a match I never thought I'd see again ~ Lord Steven Regal
vs. Fit "Mullet to the spine" Finlay, parking lot brawl. I can't believe
my good fortune on that one. I'm up to disc three on Nitro. I'm amazed at how much is in this set.
On The Wrestling Road Diaries :
Lawrence(to Eric) : I've gotten thru about the first 2/3 of Road Diaries. Bravo! I can only imagine the amount of source material you are working with to get to an actual story but it is developing nicely. I'll tell you one interesting thing...Colt comes off like a potential big personality with alot of star potential (and its clear WWE dropped the ball) where as Danielson comes off like a bitter indy star. It almost feels from the documentary like they made the wrong choice, haha. One thing that was depressing was that it is clear if they don't "make it" in WWE, they won't be able to make a living with wrestling. In that way, Colt's story comes off tragically depressing in that his ship has sailed.
Eric : Thanks! Glad you're liking it. I hope it gives a great hint of what life's been like on the indies. It's funny you interpreted it like that, because Bryan didn't seem bitter to me, outside of the seminar stuff, heh, to me he was like, "I'm gonna try to make some money, if the WWE thing doesn't work out, it's cool, whatever". But enjoy the rest!
Rodney : I’m excited to se it.
On TNA hiring indy wrestlers :
Kori : I'm curious to see what TNA does with those guys (Aries, ect.) as
tonight on Impact Wrestling they let Austin, Jimmy Rave and Kid Kash
have a decent match. I don't know if they're going to do more after the
PPV or if this is another Hardcore Justice situation, where they bring
everyone in only to drop them.
On WWE fucking up the voting on the 'Power To The People' RAW :
Kori : WWE is blaming "technical difficulties" for some of the matches from
last night. Now you would think that a company that "financially well
off" could afford something above dial-up. XD
On 3 hour RAWs :
Kori : They did a 3 hour last night, and this monday will see another 3 hour show. It's seems like oversaturation. I'm still reeling from how cool AAW was. It's gonna be on GFL soon and for $10 you'll see 9 of the 10 matches I saw live.
On Macho Man's death :
Rodney : Wow. I just can’t believe that Randy Savage is gone and at such a young age. Now Savage, Liz, and Sherry are all gone. Just sad.
Eric : with the terrible loss that happened...
the outpouring from the wrestling world is such that we HAVE to shift
gears for the next shows.
Kori : The outpouring of emmotion for Randy Savage is overwhelming. Twitter
blew up, all of WWE and TNA have been talking, all the news stations,
E!, Inside Edition, TMZ, it's been all over the place. Macho Man's feud with DDP in WCW. I think that's a strong feud. on Raw tonight, they did an angle where Big Show's knee gets run over in
a car accident. Considering recent events, this is in poor taste. But
the Macho Man tribute video that aired before the main event was well
On TNA Lockdown 2011 :
Kori : I want to point out another thing TNA did RIGHT. I taped the pre-show
(Directv gave it away for free) and the pre-show for the TNA PPV saw
D-Von score a win over Anarquia. (Matt Moragn's new partner, former OVW
wrestler.) it was an average match, but it's not every day we get to see
a cage match pre-show. ^^
On Scott Hall's inebriated appearance at Top Rope Promotion's 30th Anniversary show :
Eric : Scott Hall is gonna die. This is some of the saddest shit I've ever seen.
Lawrence : Man that is sad , I really hope he can fix himself up because that is terrible
Will Brooks : That was very sad. He's like this generations Jake the Snake Roberts. Once great wrestler turned sad story
Will Vafides : To me none of this is funny at all. This is a man that needs help and we
just had Sweeny past away. The fact some promoter sold this footage to
TMZ and other places. Plus made him work the show should be ashamed of
himself and I personally think get people on that promotors ass on him
On WWE's ratings in Mexico trumping EMLL & AAA :
Eric : CMLL & EMLL are the same thing, they're pretty much interchangeable names. It's a NWA/WCW-esque confusing history, heh.
Kori : For the Mexican audiance, I'm not surprised. I used to watch
AAA and CMLL every week without fail, but the last 5 years, the matches
have been SLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW. The storylines have been more confusing
than TNA (Yes, I mean that) and good GOD!! There are so many matches
where the wrestlers just stand around doing NOTHANG. Some of the main
event wrestlers don't even take bumps anymore. Also, with AAA there's a problem with too many heels, almost NO
faces, and everybody is in a faction. And all the factions hate each
other. Then the smaller ones fall behind Konnan, who also books. And WOW
Konnan can't book worth a damn. Again, if TNA is making more sense then
there is a PROBLEM. AAA's best wrestlers right now are La Parka (WCW not the younger
one.) Jack Evans and Dr Wagner Jr. Cibernetico and Mesias are still top
draws, but these guys are VERY reckless. CMLL's best wrestlers either went to WWE or AAA, so it's really
hard to say where they're going. They've been off of TV in my area for 4
years now. Their arena is cleaner, and the entrances are good, but the
action is minimal. When you compare a GOOD CMLL or AAA taping to a BAD Raw... easily Raw will win. I said it.
On Fit Finlay being fired from WWE :
Eric : Being that we just talked
about WCW on Sunday, I thought you'd find it interesting to note that
that means that Arn Anderson, Johnny Ace & Chavo Guerrero, Jr. are
now the only WCW employees left from the 2011 buyout. And Chavo the only
one left wrestling, heh.
Orlando : And we all know the reason why Chavo still has a job.
On UFC & WWE running back-to-back shows at Newark, NJ's Prudential Center in March :
Eric : Isn't this cute? UFC
& WWE running the same venue a DAY removed from each other? Guess
WWE's not gonna get their "no other wrestling or MMA shows in the
building we run 30 before or after the event" rule enforced this time.
Wonder if any of the crews will run in to each other, ha.
Chris : UFC is so big now the arenas are probably telling WWE to go fuck
themselves. I can see them trying to enforce when it comes to
Strikeforce but UFC is bringing way more money than wrestling these
On Brock Lesnar & Junior Dos Santos coaching The Ultimate Fighter 13 :
Rodney : sick. I'm excited that finally something concrete dismisses all the Brock leaving rumors. As exciting as this is
though I have two concerns. 1. Brock still has a lot to learn in MMA and don't know how viable of a coach he will be.
2. I don't think he could beat Junior Dos Santos. I would've picked Dos Santos Cain. It's a really bad matchup for Brock
and feel he'll get embarrassed. I hope he proves me wrong. But Brock makes for good TV so they numbers will be high
On the Edgar/Maynard main event of UFC 125 :
Rodney : awesome main event right?!
Eric : Show was good too, but Edgar won!
Rodney : Yeah I def agree that Frankie won. I thought he’d maybe win by split when they announced one judge scored for Gray. But Frankie had it in my eyes.
On Brock Lesnar rumored to be wanting to get out of MMA & back to WWE :
Eric : This really pisses me off if true.
Will Vafides : I saw this and I was thinking how bad the reporting is
Rodney : I'll cry if it's true
Will Brooks : What
a pussy he turned out to be. I mean i understand that getting your ass
beat (twice if you count the shit kicking Carwin gave him too) will
demoralize you and make you think twice. But this just seems to me like
he's running away as opposed to trying to better himself as a fighter
and win the title back. Very disappointed in our boy Brock, i figured he
had more balls than this.
On Jeff Hardy planning on pleading guilty to drug charges :
Under his plea deal, he'll only be going to jail for 45 days.
Sorry, but this color changing asshole needs a few years behind bars. I
guess this means he'll be dropping the belt to Anderson on the next PPV.
Too bad because I was looking forward to hearing Mike Tenay say that
the TNA World belt was currently a guest of the NC Prison system.
On WWE's TLC 2010 PPV :
Bill : Edge-Kane-Mysterio-Del Rio practically put me into a coma watching it. The worst TLC match I have seen to date.
On GSP/Koscheck at UFC 124 :
Chris : Koscheck is going to cause the biggest upset since Serra :)
On Jeff Jarrett's MMA gimmick :
Rodney : I actually saw the MMA Jarret last week and wanted to throw up. Are they serious????!!! For him to be in Muay Thai shorts and try and do rear naked choke holds and arm bars is embarrassing. This takes my hate for him to a whole new level and I hope that somebody kicks his ass for real.
On The Miz winning the WWE Title :
Rodney : I watched the end of Raw and couldn’t
help but cheer when The Miz won the belt haha. Looks like all my guys
are destined for greatness lol.
On UFC Featherweight Champion Jose Aldo pulling out of UFC 125 : Resolution :
Chris : This show is cursed! Hopefully they find something good to replace this fight.
On WWE's promoting(or lack thereof) for Survivor Series 2010 :
Eric : WTF is wrong with this company? So Survivor Series is fucking
Sunday, and even though they've got a RAW tonight(oooh, 6 days notice) and a
Smackdown Friday(2 days notice!), they've only got 3 matches announced :
* UNIFIED DIVAS TITLE MATCH
Layla and Michelle McCool © vs. Natalya
* WORLD TITLE MATCH
: Kane © vs. Edge
* WWE TITLE MATCH: Randy Orton © vs. Wade Barrett w/John Cena as special
referee. (NEXUS is banned from ringside, and you can only win via pin or
submission. Wade Barrett has announced that if he doesn't win the WWE Title, John Cena
will be fired on the spot. But he also added that if he wins the WWE Title,
John Cena will be relieved of all of his responsibilities in Nexus.)
Since the women's match is always
a 2-minute throwaway piss break and doesn't count, that's really only two
matches announced. Seriously, WTF is their problem?
Rodney : This is just a part of what’s wrong with the company. The fact
that Taker is fighting the same people on PPV in 2010 he did in 97 and 98 is just
I can barely remember the days when every wrestler on the roster had a
storyline in some way, shape, or form...whether it was good or bad...at
least most of the guys had something going on. They will hot-shot book
a bunch of multi-man tag matches tonight for SS. Probably throw those
old school guys in somehow.
On the post-fight encounter between Brock Lesnar & The Undertaker at UFC 121 :
Rodney : This confuses me and I don’t really know what to make of this. I was
just like what the fuck?? I’m praying that this wasn’t a work to build up to
Brock coming back to wrestling because that would be very sad and pathetic. I
read comments saying that Brock was going to come back for a WM match against
taker, because we didn’t see that 3 times on PPV already, and if somehow he
wanted to I’d def be disappointed in Brock. I was actually thinking on Monday when
I had Raw on only to see Bryan Danielson dancing with the Divas and I’m thinking
how funny it would be to see the disgust on your face seeing that.
Eric : people
talking about Lesnar going back to wrestling are being really fuckin silly
Jay : I personally think Undertaker and
Lesnar were probably fucking with us all. Or maybe Lesnar is as crazy as we all
think he is and has been talking to them about doing some business if he lost
the belt. I wouldn't take it out of the realm of possibility, but it is
Chris : This may also be him negotiating a
better deal with UFC.
Rodney : If that’s true that would be ridiculous, I’m sure he has one of
the best deals if not the best in UFC. I don’t know how much leverage he’ll
have after the 1st round ass beating he got on Saturday too.
Lawrence : Which is probably why he set the wheels in motion "just in case" so he
can put some money in the piggy bank if he eventually stops fighting by
going back to WWE. These guys aren't stupid, I'm sure you'll see Brock
back in WWE one day...they ALL COME BACK (except Rock). My reaction to this is typical of my theory (and my bias) that the
competition between MMA and Wrestling is blown out of proportion by
both fan groups (no different then ECW revolting against but working
with WWF) and is really a function of whatever the econimics are.
For example, I watched a house show (3/14/97 I believe) on WWE
24/7, the weekend of the RAW where Bret Hart faced Sid for the title in
the cage leading up to WM 13. Anyway, they brought out Shamrock and the
way they played up UFC (and what wasn't yet called MMA) was astounding
considering where things are at now. But in context, WWE and UFC were
both struggling to survive at that time and were probably looking for
any kind of relationship that would get them both over and make them
I think we will see Brock back eventually. I equate him to Angle,
who mentally thinks he is prepared for MMA and any other competition but
his body simply can't take it so the only option he has is
pro-wrestling at this point in his career. At some point, either UFC
will be done with Brock or Brock with UFC and Brock will go back because
its his only option...and/or the money will be too good to turn down.
If Brock were physically where Angle is at this point, he'd be in WWE or
Japan, and if they wouldn't have him don't be suprised if he ends up in
TNA (if they still exist) two or three years from now.
I feel like I'm always bursting the MMA bubble and playing devil's
advocate, but if you look at this stuff historically, the "battle"
between MMA and Wrestling is based on econimics and fan perception as
opposed to MMA fighters v.s. Wrestlers...
On our discussion of Chael Sonnen's drug test failure
Eric : you(Lawrence) & Rodney going, "Everyone's on drugs you idiots & so fuckin what" was an area I didn't really feel like going in to, ha.
Lawrence : I had to go there because I find it so hypocritical that one guy gets caught and most people are condemning him when it's pretty obvious people are just picking favorites. If Brock gets caught, people will blast him for it but if its Couture, people will let it slide because they like him and it'd turn into a redemption story.
Being an avid Baseball fan, I've gone back and forth with this for years. If everyone does it and we only condemn those that get caught, aren't we hypocrites? Especially, when we know they do far worse things morally than getting an "advantage' in order to win...see Michael Vick.
Great example in Vick...if you follow the Philly Eagles football team now, Michael Vick is their starting quarter back and is being used over their top prospect quarterback because he is 10 x better and the league and fans considers him "redeemed" because they are winning games and are in first place, what a joke.
If you want to kill Sonnen because there is proof he did something, I'm ok with that. You had said "we know he did it" which is factual, so fine...but don't praise Silva in the next breath for fighting with broken ribs as if he overcame special odds because they other guy was on juice.
I think some of the Roundtable guys protect MMA ;) Its not my agenda to take the bloom off the rose but someone needs to bring it down to earth every now and again. Because it is a "real sport" it is even more vulnerable to people cheating than wrestling is!
I was half joking/half sad when I said you and I are probably the only ones who even remember that El Gigante did things other then feud with Taker at Wrestlemania 9...haha
Eric : "....if you follow the Philly Eagles football team now," Yes, sure do, ha. No, I just see & hear people talking about Vick now as if nothing happened and I think that's fucked up.
And I didn't kill Sonnen; in fact, everyone else was burying him, heh. Not that I disagree outright, but I didn't say it took away from his performance or was a black eye for the sport or all that stuff, because I don't think either one of those things. That being said, I don't see how that doesn't add just a little bit at least to Silva beating him. I'm not saying by much. There were bigger odds he overcame than mere juice, which was so small a factor(if it was any at all), but it's a talking point at least.
I don't think we "protect" MMA just because we're in to it more. The last couple shows we talked about were 1. How shitty Strikeforce's shows have been and they're a mess 2. How shitty the judging & officiating of commissions have been lately 3. How bad the last UFC show was, heh. 4. How people like Liddell & Cro Cop should retire instead of being allowed to fight longer than they really should, which is the promoters' faults too. Hell, I could have just as easily not talked about the Sonnen story, and most of the guys talked about how "bad it was for the sport." All that doesn't sound like we're protecting MMA! :)
Lawrence : I suppose you're right, but I also think the Roundtable makes UFC sound like its this well oiled machine and WWE is this major train wreck (from a management and business standpoint). I think its too early too say who really has their act together more in that regard. Than again, maybe I'm a hypocrite because I always argue its apples and oranges!
Eric : Well, WWE is only a mess in a creative sense. That's something I want to bring up some point ; we always say, "This takes away from that, if they do things this way, it ruins the credibility of blank, if so & so doesn't do this then, then blah blah blah" but it seems like no matter what we say, they're still making a huge profit. Now, the NFL's killing their ratings & buyrates are down. So, my question is, how long can they afford to fuck around and still be successful(like I said, the brand "WWE" is the biggest draw, not any one person really) until it comes back to bite them?
UFC does a great job - usually - up until the fights, and that's the difference; they're not in control of their outcomes. They can hype up a fight like hell(see Rampage/Rashad from this year), but if the fight blows, that could be damaging. There's been criticism on the level of pay for undercard guys and their obsessive control ala independent contractors in WWE, but I think the one everyone just naturally feels is their lack of truly utilizing their video library.
Now, when you defended WWE's usage or promotion of wrestling history, the obvious cynical answer(certainly from me, heh) is that they're only doing it to make a few extra bucks(because McMahon and his ass-kissers are almost completely fucking ignorant to anything that's not their own history), but yeah, at least they do SOMETHING, which is better than nothing, questionable choices & all. In that sense, UFC owns WEC, WFA, IFL & Pride, where the fuck are the awesome comp.s & documentaries? I also called them recently on not including ANY Frank Shamrock fights on the Top 100 Fights Blu-ray and said they're re-writing history just like WWE does as it suits them.
So, I think we make largely fair criticism across the board, real or fake sport, heh. At least I try to keep it balanced ; people rip on WWE shit all the time, but I'll bring up their numbers too. That's why I said I don't like Orton but putting the belt on the 2nd biggest draw/babyface isn't the worst idea in the world, despite my "I want young guys" stance.
Rodney : I heard some statistics of MMA drug tests compared to other sports and it was really interesting. They were saying how fighters drug tested in UFC over the past 8 years,10 of them failed. In major league baseball in the past 5 years 50 failed drug test. FUCKING 50! And even if they’re suspended they still get paid. And I should’ve mentioned how these grappling tournaments don’t do drug
tests and I’m sure there are guys on steroids. But nobody questions
those type of things. I really enjoyed the wrestling journalism talk and I never noticed how much the headlines trick you into reading the articles haha.
Eric : Really? Come on, you're smarter than that, ha, that shit is so transparent. But yeah, like I said, MMA journalism ain't much better. I HATE that they rarely include weight classes in results in large part.
Rodney : Yeah MMA journalism still needs a lot of progress. It’s far behind journalism in major sports and by far I mean thousands of miles. I know gossip is still a big part and it’s like that everywhere but I feel a lot of MMA journalists are more critics then anything. The one thing that gets me is that some of these losers think they can dictate what fights get made and they have to approve some of these fights. I’m also excited about the New Generation era topic for the Roundtable because that’s the time when a lot of wrestling fans “didn’t watch because it was bad but started watching again during the Attitude era.” NOT ME! That’s when I started watching the most so I’m sure I’ll have a lot to say.
On US Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid claiming he will champion efforts to regulate MMA in New York City :
Lawrence : Ick, thats like the last guy you want beyond your cause!
Jay : LOL...those republicans. Give em' an inch, they'll take a mile. Just kidding...all for MMA in NYC. Harry Reid will help the cause for sure.
Lawrence : hahaha great line Jay and yes I do hope it goes thru as well!
On Batista rumored to be starting MMA :
Eric : Really?
Lawrence : Why not, I'm rooting for big Dave:)
Eric : I hope he gets his face punched in, ha
Lawrence : He'll be champion with his knife dodging and amateur skills.
On the NXT invasion :
Lawrence : The angle that ended raw last night was the coolest shit I've seen on WWE TV since about '97....totally out of the blue, crazy stuff, check it out if you missed it!!! Turned a complete joke of a thing into a white hot angle, love it
Rodney : After watching the end of Raw made me wish that it was one of those Raws we would watch at my house. We prob would've been talking about it till 2am.
Lawrence : I'm starting to think they've botched this angle completely already...seriously, if Danielson really got fired for THAT (which seems to be the case) and the next night they already doing attitude era limo non-sense (can't believe that is even a TYPE of angle because its been used so often...they used the damn limo thing for Bret Hart only 4 months ago)....ugg...all these guys need to do is show up from the crowd, punk a few people out and run away and its a hot angle. I love how Rod says if they show up in the ring with a microphone to start RAW its ruined....guess its ruined
On the ratings for TNA going against WWE on January 4th :
Eric : Wow, it may have worked!
Bret : tna is awful Bret hart rules
Lawrence : That is really wonderful news and defies alot of "smart mark" rhetoric. No matter how jaded and cynical people are and complain about stuff like "The Nasty Boys were in 3 segments" and "Desmond Wolfe shouldn't have jobbed", the fact is another (relatively unproven) wrestling show drew significant viewers against WWE. Against the return of Bret Hart nonethless (long thought to be the biggest angle WWE could EVER do!)
Alot of people will accredit this to news getting around about Jeff Hardy, curiosity over Hogan or just beginners luck. I'm sorry, but I still think there are MILLIONS of people who stopped watching after WWE bought WCW and they are out there looking for anything. The fact that TNA not only satisfied that, but established a little something of their own is remarkable.
THIS is by far the biggest and best wrestling news in a long time. Here is my stream of consciousness from what I remember:
-nWo theme from WCW Mayhem!?
-AJ/Angle and Pope/Nigel....best Monday Night Wrestling Matches in a long time!
-Big Show is really awesome for his size and just in general
-Bret didn't look so great and seemed out of place :(
-Bischoff is awesome and believable
-McMahon is not awesome and is not believable
-Michaels and Bret hugging....surreal, I don't think that EVER happened on television
-Sting in the rafters watching over the nWo!
So, alot of throwback...but alot of new stuff and it was really excited flipping back and forth between two wrestling shows... I love DVR! I can't imagine having that during the "original" Monday Night Wars, it's cheating
On TNA & WWE's re-creation of the Monday Night Wars on January 4th :
Eric : So we've got a new Hart
Foundation, DX, Raven & Stevie Richards, Outsiders & X-Pac,
Hogan, Bret Hart, etc. in 2010? What fucking year is this again? What's
old is old again!
And Undertaker is the champ!!!
On Bret Hart re-signing with WWE :
Will : Loving that Bret is being the bigger man abd returning to the WWE. TNA don't have a chance.
Lawrence : Eric and I have talked at length about how Bret coming back is still sort of underwhelming in the scope of things and they really need to move on from anything attitude related. Infact, the only thing that would make my head spin is Savage showing up on RAW (and even that would need to be a total suprise). But, I'm not that cynical and I will mark out seeing Bret come back especially if its in the context of a pretend Monday Night War.
What's really crazy is the "one upsmanship" they are already doing. Everyone was takling TNA/Hogan Monday Night War and now everyone is talking Bret Hart...so you know TNA isn't stupid and will want to throw money EVERYWHERE to counter this...what if they manage to get Austin?
I think TNA should blow everything up that night and run a show that reminds people of "the old Nitro" that people watched with Hogan, Nash, Sting and introduces AJ, Joe, Hernandez and guys like that...they need to do something really big to get the channel's to turn.
Chris : If The Rock and Bret are on the 1/4 Raw then TNA has absolutely no chance of even getting onto most people's radar that night. They need to start advertising the shit out of Hogan coming in live and try to get someone like Austin, Savage or Flair to come, even it's just for a short term deal like Bret has. They can't rely on surprise guests at this point, they need to get the word out that big names are coming and new guys will be showcased. They should do everything they can to get air time on UFC's 1/2 PPV and be buying up spots on Raw, SmackDown, Superstars and ECW every single week in every major market.
On our favorite topic, Triple H, and the Slammys :
Rodney : One of the clips of Raw I watched was when HHH was presenting match of the year and one of the commentators said, "HHH definitely knows about match of the year he's had a couple of those." And I'm thinking what!!!!??? Can anybody name even one?
Lawrence : Thats a good point, I'm thinking Vs Foley at the Rumble and Vs Austin at nWo 3 stages of hell..but then again I'm probably missing a dozen other "he who we do not speak ofs", Angle matches and something involving Austin or Rock that was better?
Eric : HHH has had a ton of great matches and a whole bunch of "Match Of The Year"s....just not in the past half decade or so, ha
Chris : The last one he had was probably the WrestleMania 20 main event. The Royal Rumble match against Foley was definitely up there and knowing WWE they probably include some of his matches with Michaels.
Rodney : Yeah I would agree saying WM 20 is the latest candidate but would that be over Angle/Eddie at Summerslam?
Eric : Big time. Angle/Guerrero was great but a little too short, not the main event, and made Eddie look like a loser on top of it. WM20, well, I don't need to say it, do I?
On Sheamus winning the WWE title from Cena at TLC :
Lawrence : I'm just happy someone different won rather unexpectedly! someone different won. lol, I love this stuff...somehow I don't think Sheamus is going to be getting "U S A" heat. I really am excited to have a Monday Night Wars party:)
Rodney : Well I guess being HHH's boy pays off once again. Just proves they can push people if they choose to. I hope you enjoyed the fights on Saturday. Overall it was good show, I'm surprised Diego lasted as long as he did.
On Shane McMahon quitting WWE & meeting with UFC President Dana White :
Eric : Shane McMahon quits?? Probably 1. to help his mommy run for senate, or 2. Him & Steph/Steph's husband pushed him out on favor of Vince's 'real' son!
Bill : I have a feeling it's the latter..
Lawrence : hahahahahah, what a circus. Its like the invasion storyline, haha. McMahon and Ventura doing commentary last night was surreal....McMahon was so quick to point out that Mark Henry had the clear advantage in the battle royal, hahaha
Chris : See what happens when you aren't Tweeting or playing those damn video games.
On Brock Lesnar's illness :
Alex Payne : Well, that really sucks except the fact he won the UFC Heavyweight championship at under a 100%. Potentially, he wont be able to fight again and that sucks since I'm a Brock fan. I guess it's time for Dana to strip Brock of the belt... unfortunately.
On Hulk Hogan/Eric Bischoff signing with TNA :
Lawrence : holy shit i just read this stuff all over the place,!
Rodney : hahah wow times must really be tough for Hogan.
Chris : I'm surprised they didn't have a parade on the Universal City Walk in Orlando.
Rodney : Sweet so 9 years later we'll get to see Hogan, Russo, and Jarret repeat Bash at the Beach!
Eric : So....Russo & Ferrara, Hogan & Friends, an nWo rip-off faction, they must REALLY want to be just like the bad WCW! At least we can get that Cactus Jack/Hogan match finally, right?
Lawrence : Obviously the internet is like "this is bad WCW, Nash and Hogan and friends will be on top and Bischoff will hold down the youn guys". However, this is much different!
First of all, regarding the politics: they have been horrible for years in TNA with Jarret and Angle who aren't nearly the drawing or star power that Hogan is. If anything, Hogan will pick a new guy to be his heir apparent like HHH has chosen Batista and Orton who are far less intriguing than some of the TNA prospects (Joe, Morgan, Nigel, Hernandez, Nigel, etc.)
As it pertains to the booking, this is a win-win. Either Bischoff will push out Russo which will bring an entirely new approach to these terribly bland WWF99 Reruns or there will finally be a filter on his ideas . Bischoff has had almost a decade away from the game and oen of the reasons he lost his midas touch in '98 was needing a break.
Finally, there are fresh matchups that will come from this. I don't think anyone will be interested in Hogan/Jarret, Hogan/Nash, Hogan/Steiner or the like. Certainly a heel Hulk Hogan would be terrible. However, babyface Hogan/ heel Joe, babyface Hogan/heel Foley or a real feud with Hogan/Angle could generate interest. Perhaps Hogan is the right guy to get Lashely over?
Lest we forget, there are alot of people out there with bad blood towards WWE who were just waiting for the right opportunity to sign on in some capacity: Flair, Savage, Kennedy and lots of creative people from Wrestling's past like Cornette and Heyman who can add a shitload in a "new" TNA.
I think this could be a big deal.
Infact, my only worry is Bischoff over marketing new TV rather then focusing on the Spike/Impact relationship and using UFC to his advantage.
Chris : I was just listening to Bubba to see what he had to say about Hogan. Hogan called in and said TNA is in serious communication with Macho Man right now. The Ric Flair and second show on Monday night rumors are running wild right now but TNA might be able to really step it up if all of this is true.
On Brock Lesnar's title defense against Shane Carwin being pushed back from November to January :
Chris : This sucks!
Rodney : NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!
Eric : Doesn't that mean Lesnar/Carwin & Anderson Silva/Vitor Belfort on the same card? That's pretty awesome, but that Nov. show's gonna ride completely on Tito Ortiz' name now
Chris : They could bump Anderson Silva's fight up to Super Bowl weekend since they haven't officically announced a date yet. Tito's gonna sell this show but they better come up with something else to co-mainevent this show.
Lawrence : My theory is that Brock got wind of what you guys said on the UFC show and realized it would be better to postpone the fight, lol
On Captain Lou Albano's death :
Bill : Remember on the Rock N'Wrestling cartoon when the Captain moved in with Hulk Hogan and proceeded to be Oscar Madison to Hogan's Felix Unger? I'll never forget the special breakfast he prepared for Hogan: peanut butter and pepperoni pancakes.."Back in the medulla of my brain I've got an IQ of 901.73"
Lawrence : My fav Captain Lou moment was at Paul Vachon's Wedding Reception. He did a belching toast, danced with a midget against his fat stomach and started a riot. Of course his advice to the lovelorn from TNT is classic, look it up on youtube!!!!
Bill : Advice for the Lovelorn was on the Coliseum Video Albano VHS from 1985.
Capt: Well, you've got to get your husband on the ball. If there's one thing I can't stand, it's fat people..
McMahon: Then how would you describe yourself, Mr. Albano?
Capt: This isn't fat. It's 100% pure muscle.
Uncle Howie : one of the worlds most funniest men is gone on interviews he was unbelivabul he is going to be miss thanks guys for sending me all that goog shit to watch now lets all hang our heads an shear a tear fot the capt.
On CM Punk being booked to be squashed by The Undertaker in the opening match of Hell In The Cell due to his behavior regarding the dresscode :
Eric : Hope this is true!
Lawrence : I love this silly macho stuff because everyone involved looks like an idiot. The dress code is a metaphor for the wellness policy. Only certain people need to abide by it, and those who don't are depushed or artifically suspended. When is the last time Shawn Michaels or Undertaker wore a suit on television! Does Hornswoggle have to wear a suit:) Isn't the guys last name supposed to be "Punk". Cute how it ends in the end of Punk's pretend "push"
Rodney : Eric remember I said the world is one big high school? This is a perfect example. Unless punk was wearing tight pink sweatpants or dressed in drag I doubt what he was wearing would be that unacceptable for travel. They use an unofficial dress code as an excuse to stop the push of a "new star." This is funny because this would never happen to Orton or Batista. It's just another reason for them to put the belt on one of their established guys who first won their belt 18 YEARS AGO. I guess Punk is still paying his dues.....
Chris : Undertaker and Batista... again? Surely neither one of them will get hurt in the near future so they have nothing to worry about. Also, Edge should be back in the next 3 months so they can add him to this feud to make it fresh right before WrestleMania.
Lawrence : Great point Chris, maybe they'll be able to do Undertaker/Batista/Edge and Orton/Cena/HHH just in time for WM...although rumor has it they are going to do a really new concept..............HHH/HBK (statute of limitations is about 5 years?)
Rodney : If it hasn't happened in 5 years it hasn't happened at all. Undertaker is champ, we're back to the era where thrown together wrestlers are now the tag team scene, and we're seeing DX do the same shit they did 3 years ago. Times are changing
Lawrence : Just you wait for the big Edge face turn that flops like HHH in 2002 and the dreaded RKO feud they never got to pull the trigger on years ago burying even those two in the midcard so they can run with HHH/HBK and Undertaker/Batista for another year. Maybe we'll get Taker/Kane!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
On Bryan Danielson going to WWE :
Eric : Not totally surprsing, but still shocking.
Rodney : Holy Shit!!! Well, now we have a reason to watch. It's gonna be wonderful to see what stupid name they call him on ECW.
Lawrence : Marquis Corvon Part 2
On Brock Lesnar next UFC Heavyweight title defense against Shane Carwin in November :
Rodney : I'm a little nervous about this fight
Lawrence : Lets Go Lesnar!
Alex Payne : Well, if Brock loses then at least he had fun run at as Heavyweight Champion. Carwin's got a sick uppercut, see Ganzaga, so if Brock can stay away from that he could be fine.
On lack of new stars on RAW :
Chris : Why worry about this? They will just draft Morrison and Ziggler over to Raw and then stick them in the midcard while Triple H, Orton and Cena feud for another 3 years. Problem solved.
On how predicting where wrestling will be in 10 years :
Brian : if you did this in 1999, thinking where we'd be in 2009... is it me or has like NOTHING changed. "give us our day our daily dx reunion." best line from wrt ever.
Rodney : I can't wait to talk about Cena vs.Triple H for WM26.
On Fedor Emelianenko's negotiations with UFC & StrikeForce weeks ago :
Rodney : The (Affliction) business strategy was
doomed from the beginning. Just because a lot of the "where do you
train!" fans wear Affliction shirts, doesn't mean they make up enough of the
population to bring Affliction events mainstream. Especially with the UFC
counterprogramming them any chance they get. On free TV. They're stupid for even trying to promote a "Randy vs Fedor" fight
when one of the fighters is still under contract. Hopefully it works out for
the best and hopefully UFC gets Fedor.
Eric : WHO'S READY TO FLY TO VEGAS
FOR THIS AT THE ULTIMATE ULTIMATE IN DECEMBER?! Undisputed UFC Champion
Brock Vs. Pride & WAMMA Champion Fedor.
Rodney : I am SO FUCKIN excited about Dana's press
conference on Friday. I love how he acknowledged that nobody really wanted to
see Hendo/Franklin 2 and they scratched that. That would NEVER happen in
wrestling. All we get is shows and matches we don't wanna see. I'm hoping they
announce a tv deal with ESPN, Tito coming back to fight, and of course FEDOR VS.
BROCK. I'm with you Eric on flying out for that fight.
Lawrence : Wow now that will be ufcs wrestlemania 3. Even if nothing is set in stone for Fedor (I'm not sure if they've
made anything official as of 3:45 EST) but the writing is on the wall
and between that, UFC 100 they are probably getting huge offers and
opportunities right now.
Great point Rod that we ALWAYS get what we don't want with WWE. ANd its not us just bitching, because NOONE wants it....
Internet marks want Jericho, Punk, Evan Bourne on top
Kids want Cena, Hardy, Mysterio on top
NOBODY wants Shaq, ZZ Top or Seth Greene, NOBODY wants "ecw" or to
see Tommy Dreamer ever again, or Vladmir "Sambo on my shorts" Kozlov,
or HHH E V E R unless hes "dx"....its unbearable
Eric : I can't BELIEVE how many
concessions Dana White's made for Fedor & his team(more than they've done
for ANYone) but they STILL refuse to sign! I's probably because Fedor
can't defy his manager because he's Russian mob and so's his brother, or some
shit like that. We know how the Yakuza are in Japan so it's probably true
because really, that's the most ridiculous deal in UFC history and they're NOT
going to take it? FUCK! Who does M-1 think they are? A cut of the PPV revenue
& their shirts on PPV isn't good enough? Get the fuck outta
Lawrence : Accck that sucks, Fedor definitely has inept management because if he
loses one fight in strike force that UFC deal will be off the table
Rodney : JESUS CHRIST. It's funny because it was these type of deals
that was a catalyst of Randy Coutoure leaving a year and half ago. $5 million a
fight!!!! What the hell is their problem, they'll never get that somewhere else.
I think you're right about Fedor's manager. I don't think it's Fedor himself
who's denying these offers but his dickhead management. His manager doesn't
think UFC should hold a monopoly over MMA and will deny the world until they
agree to co promote. I think there's a better chance of Kim Kardashian sleeping
over my house tonight.
Eric : From what I've read of Vadim Finkelchstein(sp, Fedor's manager),
he seems to be saying that M-1 doesn't want UFC to take hold in Russia
as that's 'their' territory. We all know UFC's been expanding
internationally, so I bet you M-1 is staking their claim and is being a
hard ass so they don't let UFC penetrate their territory. NWA/WWWF
Also, Kim Kardashian's already sleeping over my house tonight, sorry. I'll tell her you said hello.
Lawrence : Basically if M-1 lets this go down , no matter what UFC concedes...UFC
gets the guy. I think if UFC refuses to co-promote M-1's doing the
right thing from a survival perspective. I know everyone wants this bad but this is M-1's only "chip" in the game. The NWA wouldn't loan Flair over to Vince in '87. M-1 has to milk this for every last bit
because they are basically giving UFC permission to have a monopololy,
its a HUGE step. I know UFC is hitting on all cylinders, and PRIDE and the like
aren't/weren't exactly "competition" but anything that hands them
WWE-level control over an entire industry will hurt the whole sport in
the long run. You want the Brock/Fedor fight, not a UFC monopoly. Trust me if you really like MMA you don't want UFC getting
permission from the world to be the only game in town. You'll great it
if people like TIm Sylvia are on top! We're always comparing WWE to UFC, the worst thing that ever
happened to the Wrestling business was Vince having ultimate control.
Eric : Fuck that, I want them to have a monopoly, heh.
Rodney : I disagree. UFC is the brand that brought MMA to the masses
and they are the only ones with the business savvy to take this sport to the
next level. Most fans don't even know what MMA is, they know UFC. Plus
Strikeforce is a great alternative that seems to be doing well and you have
other small organizations all over the world. Them holding a monopoly would kind
of suck for the fighters because now slugs like Tim Silvia can't get paid
$800,000 for getting submitted in 40 seconds. It's like any other sport, if you
wanna play football you work your ass off to be in the NFL, basketball- NBA,
Lawrence : Well it won't be with Fedor that seems for sure. The WWF was able to take wrestling "to the masses " in a period
where the NWA was developing and marketing huge stars on huge shows to
huge crows. The moment WWE absorbed WCW and ECW (think
PRIDE/Affliction) was the begining of the homogenzied, political crap
we have to endure now. Everytime a new talent gets developed in a smaller company like
TNA or ROH, the WWE makes some sort of offer and that talent gets
locked up in limbo. People like AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, Goldberg, Dallas
Page and Brian Danielson should be mega international personalities but
the WWE's monopoly prevents it. Fedor going to UFC will generate a huge buy rate and afew years of
mega success, UFC will then absorb the strike forces and any
international promotions ala WWE from the 80's throuh 2001. We will get
some short term excitement, but it will not develop into the NFL, NBA
or MLB because there are no colleges that have MMA where talent can't
be developed in a sense OTHER then a business sense with perspectives
that aren't Dana Whites/Vince McMahons/David Sterns..etc....UFC isn't ready for that at any level. Fedor could be their Hogan
but without proper organizations to develope Savage, Flair an Andre for
him its worthless.
Rodney : I defintely understand what you are saying but the big
difference is that UFC gives people WHAT THEY WANT. Dana White is
much smarter than McMahon. When they signed Wanderlei Silva the FIRST
thing they did is put him against Chuck because that's a match people wanted to
see for a long time. Whenever they acquire Pride guys they put them in
matches that are intriguing and what fans want to see. When Goldberg
came what happened. He got beat up by the Rock for 3 or 4 weeks, got
new tights, new music, and had a horrible match. The 1 dream match with him
and Brock wasn't even built around them and done when his contract was just
about up. The difference with Afflication and WCW is Affilication was
never a threat to UFC. They had a lot of money to spend just like WCW did
but they never had the marketing and business smarts UFC did. In only their
3rd show everyone was waiting for them to go under as a promotion and before
that even happened they pulled their own plug.
They want Fedor because they know it's what the fans want.
Look what they're doing with Kimbo. They're putting him in a position to give
Ultimate Fighter HUGE numbers. And that's someone Dana White publicly
said sucked. Dana took Brock Lesnar and made him the top story on Sports
Center. If Brock went to another organization they wouldn't market him in a way
to make him the superstar he is now. WWE is in their own bubble and do
goofy things like make DDP a stalker regardless of the ridiculous pop he got
when he debuted. UFC isn't in the same bubble.
Lawrence : Dana White is a business man and he'll do whatever he has to, to
preserve his monopoly but its can clearly be to his own detriment and
his ego is just as dangerous as McMahons. Thats why you get things like
"Ive decided Chuck Lidell is retired" and all these silly blog
controversies he gets himself into. Its only the begining, and UFC
(unlike Wrestling) can't control outcomes. If Brock goes out there and
kills Fedor, you innevitably break even because Fedor's draw is gone
ala Cro Cop and you've made money on one match. Noone will care about
the rematch because everyone knows once you put the guy over you don't
revisit it cuz it could screw up both guys 'heat'. Then if you go Brock/Mir "rubber match" you risk Brock losing 2/3
to someone who a month ago was "hot" but now is going to end up like
Arlovski. Things like that fly under the radar, Arlovski was a decent star
for them but Dana White is too cool for him now so he sends a quote to
the media that we don't need that scrub...thats theshit that will
happen ALOT if tey get Fedor full fledged and it will stall UFC's
Chris : I have to agree with Rod on all of this. If Vince were to bring in
Samoa Joe he would make him start at the very bottom, even if a large
portion of the fans know who he is and he gets a huge pop the moment he
steps through the curtain. Dana White doesn't care about all of that.
Fedor hasn't proven to be a draw in America yet. His biggest PPV
buyrate was 200,000. If UFC 101 were to get that kind of number BJ Penn
would probably never headline again on PPV. Dana is really bending over
backwards for this guy because the fans want it and everyone is going
to come out bigger in the end. UFC is a marketing machine and they can
sell anyone to the public. They already footage of Fedor in Pride and
they could start hyping him tonight if he signs the deal. M1 is really
going to screw him over he doesn't take this.
Lawrence : The point that Fedor is an unproven drawin the states is a really good
one. I just hate when the big boy on the block throws money at
something (like the Yankees) and everyone feels its just the natural
order of things!
Rodney : This sucks because it's getting all our hopes up about a
guy who's management is refusing $5 million a fight.
Posted on an article Alex Marvez wrote about Fedor/UFC :
Eric : "...don't be surprised if White makes a run at an athlete who can help bolster his thin heavyweight ranks" What? You must be talking about Strikeforce, because the heavyweight divison in UFC is hardly in the shape it was years ago. First of all, Lesnar was scheduled to fight Mark Coleman first(former champion & Hall Of Famer who has since dropped out of the division, though admittedly past his prime) then Cheick Kongo(who seemed to be climbing the ranks), neither of which happened due to training injuries, and he trounced their replacements. Now, Kongo looks to be facing Frank Mir next as both are coming off losses to fresher heavyweights. Lesnar will probably be facing the winner of Minotauro Nogueira & Randy Couture, and I haven't even mentioned Shane Carwin Vs. Cane Velasquez yet(two undefeated fighters probably next in line for a title shot). So far, Lesnar has defeated two former heavyweight champions & a former Pride heavyweight title contender in his UFC run, and we haven't even mentioned Mirko Cro Cop or former contender Gabriel Gonzaga. Lesnar has plenty of interesting matchups and contenders at the moment, so even though Bobby Lashley or Fedor Emelianenko would make interesting and/or great additions to the UFC, I'd hardly say UFC has 'thin heavyweight ranks.'
On the pictures of Hulk Hogan's spine & Jeff Hardy :
Lawrence : Its scary because hes willing to try ANYTHING to be able to wrestle. The
doctors are telling him he should get surgery to have a comfortable
lifestyle.....not necessarily to frickin bump:(
Rodney : Man this is why every indy wreslter trying to pursue this
should read Ring of Hell. Hogan's 55, made a shitload of money, and gets back
surgery so he can wrestle again?! The guy can barely walk
Chris : Hogan wrestled a pretty safe style compared to some of these other
guys. Imagine what Jeff Hardy's spine is going to look like at 55.
Jeff hardy is not making it to see 55
Rodney : It's crazy to think after 10 years of Hardy jumping around
he's still selling a shitload of merchandise. But like Lawrence said, he's a
hero to troubled teens and I guess that's a big percentage of their fanbase. I
like looking at numbers too like ratings and payouts and all that. I think
that within the next year UFC will be within top 3 of the biggest PPV draws of
all time. Besides De La Hoya/ Mayweather it's all Tyson and he's done and I
don't see another Mike Tyson in boxing anytime soon. Jeff Hardy is getting dirtier everytime I see him on
TV, you must be thrilled to see your two favorite stars fight for the same belt
Flair and Sting fought for! hahaha
Eric : Thanks for depressing me with the Punk/Hardy &
Rodney : UGH I know that's the state of pro wrestling that we're in.
Thank god we have an alternative.
On Tag Teams :
Eric : Ok, so the DVD is called WWE Allied Powers : The World's Greatest Tag Teams, right?
Who's on the cover? HHH & HBK aka DX 06. So, that makes them what? Say it with me : A TAG TEAM
course, they have the faction of the Freebirds on the cover too, but
fuck that, they did 'Wolfpack rules' before Demolition or the nWo!
Plus, how can they have the names "Allied Powers " and "World's
Greatest Tag Teams" on the cover but not Luger/Bulldog &
Hass/Benjamin? Edge & Christian are on the cover but not Rock N
Roll Express? Fuck this DVD.
Lawrence : Any Tag Team DVD that doesn't have a picture of Hawk and Animal,
Hart and Neidhart, Michaels and He Who We are LUCKY to Speak Of is not
something I'd be interested in:) I won't take WWF putting those two dorks on the cover of a DVD
as them being a tag team;) There is noway they are a tag team and not
faction and the Freebirds are a faction and not a tag team....the
Freebirds have on more tag team championships then DX! Rated RKO , is ita faction or a tag team? Was Lita included.....if so then its a faction? Or was she managing a tag team? Eric, you are .....wrong. Of course I'm just joking because it doesn't matter since the
current "tag team" champions are two singles wrestlers who aren't even
on thame same brand but THAT is a whole different and equally
ridiculous discussion. Eric's analysis at this point is accurate, and screw this stuipd DVD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Rodney : that's the first thing I thought of. DX on the cover????
They're not even a tag team!!!! And it's funny in the way we laugh whenever
Triple H squashes his way to a title shot that everyone else's pics are small
and in the corner and DX takes up the majority of the cover. They never even won
the belts together!!!! DX06 was gay, not funny, and sucked the first week they
came out as DX. And they were a faction. BTW did you hear about what Triple H said on Raw???? Really
this guy is fucking out of control and a complete dick.
On WWE's staleness :
Chris : I mentioned it on the message board a few weeks ago, but why the hell
is Raw turning into Saturday Night Live with horrible guest hosts,
terrible comedy sketches and bands that haven't had a hit in 20+ years.
If for some reason UFC were to bring in a musical act I would have to
think it would be someone relevant like say 50 Cent to actually perform
someone like Rampage's entrance music. I would love to just sit on one
creative meeting to see what the hell gets discussed where they think
Jeremy Piven is great idea to guest host a wrestling program.
Rodney : Remember the days when we'd get excited about wrestlers
jumping promotions??? Man have those passed us by. Even if that happened today I
cringe at possibility of seeing Samoa Joe on ECW jobbing to Matt
Hardy. I always wanted to
see an Aja Kong/ Alunda Blayze match which is what they were going for at time.
But Maduse trashing the belt on Nitro didn't help that out. Ha I remember thinking back then why they would scratch
Shawn's revenge match against Sid. But it worked out for the best.
Chris : Triple H, Orton, Cena, HBK, Batista, Undertaker and
Edge. Not only have
these guys done all of these PPV's but since 2002 when the brand split
began they've been the 7 guys that have somehow been in a mainevent on
every single show. Not including Royal Rumbles because I can think of
at least one where one of these guys wasn't in the last match (Angle vs
Mark Henry) but Cena and Edge had a title match on the show so count them as co-mainevents.
Rodney : Wow and that Vengeance PPV still had Edge in it who has
been in the title picture since the beginning of 2006. So the last WM without
those 3 is someone who hasn't wrestled in 6 years won the belt. Austin is in the
freakin hall of fame! Jesus. that's great. 44 out of 51 main events with the same 5
guys. Evolution, The guy who came out of retirement 7 yrs ago, and their new
star who they jobbed out all of last year. I bet nothing changes
Lawrence : WOW! Amazing stuff, may I add that Cena does deserve the main
event of mania every year because he is the top star, sells merchandise
and is the eras Hogan. HOWEVER, the other two have no business. HHH
didn't have business in the main event as far back as X-8.....Hogan was
in the main events of the first 7/8 manias (8, if you count
Wrestlemania 9......9, if you consider Hogan/Andre at Wrestlemania 4 a
main event prior to the show itself as a draw)....BUT, he was HOGAN and
he didn't face Bundy and Dibiase at 9 of those manias!!! Hogans opponents are a whose who of major stars for the period:
Piper, Bundy, Andre, Macho, Warrior, Sid and Iraqi Sympathetic
On Taz' TNA debut :
Eric : I like how we're supposed to buy that he's a bad ass again like old Taz after 9 years of "Hey Cole, it's Hulkamania!"
Lawrence : I love Eric's Taz impression because it summarizes how far he fell from being this bad ass FTW guy! "HEY COLE ITS HULKAMANIA" Maybe they are starting a fat bad ass faction. I hope Taz has dropped weight, started training again and gets a
fresh start in TNA so they can make WWE look bad. He'll probably end up
being Joe's manager and it'll be like Rude/Henning in the nWo in the
Mafia. Should be fun watching Taz/Nash together though. TNA has no clue. Taz and Nash in the same group alone should cause the universe to explode.
On WCW being bought 8 years ago :
Lawrence : I think time has shown this is by far the biggest and most embarassing failure in the history of wrestling. The quote below is like a summary of what DIDN't happen :
"We are assuming a brand with global distribution and recognition. We
are adding thousands of hours to our tape library that can be
repurposed for home videos, television, Internet streaming, and
broadband applications. The WCW opens new opportunities for growth in
our Pay Per View, live events, and consumer products divisions, as well
as the opportunity to develop new television programming using new
stars. We also will create additional advertising and sponsorship
opportunities. In short, it is a perfect fit."-Linda McMahon
-Global Distribution and Recognition (24/7 and afew DVDs?, not exactly GLOBAL)
-WCW opening up new opportunities for grown in PPVS, live events and products (yeah, from about July2001 until about September 2001)
-Develop new television programming using new stars (well, its been 8 years and I think Chavo Guerrero is the ONLY person from the original aquisition thats been there the whole time...and he isn't exactly a star)
-Additional advertising and sponsorship opportunities (never happened)
-"in short its a perfect fit" (hahaahahhaahahahha)
Zac : lol Eh fuck it we'll just embarass all of the WCW guys creatively and competitively.
On RAW a week before Judgment Day :
Rodney : I'll have it on in the
background but I'll switch out of it a lot. It really is the SAME PREDICTABLE
shit. For example last night Orton comes out and says he ended the McMahon era
last week, then he looks up at the Titantron. They played a recap of last week
and within 5 seconds it was the slow motion with dramatic music and bomb sound
effects.... I changed it right away. I knew you were sick of those videos and I
always appreciated good editing but now it's like COME
ON. I watched the
best of the 90's stars DVD and I don't know how they could produce that DVD and
still look at they're product like it's good. UGH
. we were really spoiled. It really sucks that
wrestling fans today who just started getting into it didn't get so enjoy the
great stuff we enjoyed. But they do get DVD's and 24/7.
Dr Keith Lipinski(Wrestling Observer & Big Vision Entertainment) :
Eric - is one fantastic fellow-who's show is actually quite good. Give yourself a barry horwitz pat on the back.
Lawrence : BTW: the Raw up on 24/7 is the one where Owen confronts Vince after
IYH: DX and gets huge face heat for ripping into him! For all they did
right in 97/98, they missed a huge opportunity with Owen. They did such
a great job building foley up as austins little buddy then doing the
turn, but imagine Owen in that role instead of or in addition to?
Zac : i had a funny wacky alternate history angle. I didnt watch
when Evolution was on, but think this would've been great. They feud
with The "Christian's Crusaders" faction which is Christian, Booker T
and Brother Love. They feud with them because " A good christian doesnt
believe in evolution.. It doesnt exist." Hilarity ensues. Heat ensues.
They brainwash Kane to join the faction. Then they brainwash Orton.
Culminating in Christian vs HHH at WM lol Maybe a dinosaur bone shot.
The possibilities are endless.
On the new Macho Madness DVD :
Lawrence : Man I miss the macho man!!! For those that haven't seen it, the '85 stuff is fascinating
because his first order of business is challenging Hogan! Its extra
awesome that they included an '85 Steamboat match and the match with
(and hopefully some of the angle that leads to ) Sammartino.Hogan must have been so threatened by this guy, hahaha...They
brought in practically the entire Mid-Atlantic and AWA main event scene
by '85 (Steamboat, Tito, Hammer, Piper, etc...) but this guy outshined
I'm glad we systematically ripped up DX 2006:)
Rodney : They should've put the Macho Man music video from '93 in
Before Backlash 2009 :
Eric : Jericho/Steamboat - although
a month too late - might be interesting. Of course, it'll probably just
be a repeat of what we saw at WM, but Steamboat is the man afterall.
The Jericho/Steamboat match is probably the only thing worth watching but Swagger/Christian could be good as well.
On Dwayne Johnson, The Rock, laughing off John Cena's(really WWE's) silly attempts of getting pub. by challenging Johnson to come back to wrestling to fight The Rock :
Eric : I
like how he just laughs and dismisses their goofy attempt to create a
What I find funny is that they are dying for main stream media
attention, so they bring Mickey Rourke in to punch Jericho and noone cares
(they couldn't even get Rourke to do what they really wanted was an actual
match). at first I was like, "fuck Cena, what a tool, he'd do the same thing"
but I was pondering how gitty we are when people Rock and Brock are
successful outside of wrestling (especially WWE) to spite wrestling. I
wonder if things were different and we enjoyed the shows and supported
the company if we'd still feel the same way about Rock "shunning where
he came from". I've always thought the notin of "the sickness" was
really pathetic, but at the same time its sad that things are so
terrible Rock isn't even comfortable doing an inring spot at RAW 15
or a one off match with Cena. Just shows how unique wrestling is, even
the Beatles considered getting back together!
Rodney : I thought that was great. WWE's biggest star just thrown
under the rug by a real star!
On WrestleMania 25 :
Sal : T
hought it was a very good PPV overall, but not a good value for a price
of $60-$70(!) for HD version depending on provider. Loved UT/HBK and
MitB, liked Jericho-Steamboat / Hardys / Rey-JBL / Cena-Edge-Show,
hated the rest. Would have been worth $50 TOPS. God that fuckin main
event was horrible. It felt like they were building to an Orton win,
and Punk cashing in to get revenge for Orton costing him the belt to
Jericho, but then I realized HHH would never go out like that at
Wrestlemania, LOL, and I was right
As of today, the 2009 WWE Royal Rumble PPV did 445,000 buys worldwide, with roughly 268,000 coming from North America. Last year's show did 575,00 PPV buys worldwide, meaning that this year's event suffered roughly a 23% drop.
Lawrence : No suprise, probably the economy more then anything else.
Rodney : I think it's the product. They're still selling out shows so and I haven't heard of them suffering in ticket sales. I guess Edge vs. Jeff Hardy and not a lot of hype to the Rumble didn't get people to buy.
Lawrence : Koko B. Ware in the hall of fame...uggg..Savage and Sammartino are not, but Koko B. Ware is the ULTIMATE jobber. Never won a key singles title, never had a memorable match. I really think the Bushwackers should go in now, its only fair!
Rodney : What was funny was that during the video package they showed him beating a bunch of jobbers. I think in one clip he was actually drop kicking Skinner.
Lawrence : So even based on THAT, koko shouldn't be in any hall of fame:) The only reason he is in is because he's a WWF wrestler from the 80's that was featured on WWF baseball cards, ice cream cookie sticks and sang "Pile Driver" hahaha
Lawrence : I know Triple Crown is WWF World, Tag and IC (which after 98 became a pretty useless distinction) ...what constitutes Grand Slam? I guess those plus euro and hardcore? Grand Slam means 4 runs in baseball so that other thing would really be Pentagonical distinction :) lol
Then again, maybe none of this matters because the two title matches at Wrestlemania are happening because one guys wife got kicked in the head and the other guys wife is cheating on him.....and if someone wins a briefcase they can have a shot:)
Eric : Grand Slam=WWF World title, IC, Euro & World tag
Lawrence : Wow this stuff is RIDICULOUS. Grand Slam status is like worthless now because the WWF (company, not the raw brand featuring WWF titles) has SO many titles. To be some sort of 'grand slam' in the current structure, you'd need to win ALL those titles they have now. Things were so much simpler then!
To me, winning the Euro title only counted until Shane McMahon won it and even then it was a prop. The IC title stopped meaning anything once they used it to help HHH's memorial WCW title have crediblity and the tag belts switch importance depending on who has them and which 'brand' has the better workers. Hardcore title never mattered, haha
I wonder where Mysterio fits in, did he win the WCW Cruserweight tag titles? lol
You'd think by now he should have won the US and IC title...
Eric : It's not arguing whether they mean anything or not, none of them do or did, just saying how ridiculous it is that they decorate these pieces of shit with them
Lawrence : Yeah its a sad state of affairs!
You HAVE to look up the HHH/Orton skit last night, its pricless...going to be the Katie Vick of this era.
Meltzer and Alvarez were debating who the other people in the house wore on their show, it was really funny. Meltzer is like "who are these people, why are they alone in rooms after 10:00PM? Its not the maid, she would have left. Its not the gardener. Unless the maid and the gardner live there. If they live there, they wouldnt be in a room by themselves standing around...the only room you would use is the bathroom that late, or maybe the computer room, or in a room listening to the radio getting ready for sleep."
Then he surmised that they were clearly production people 'acting' as either members of Ortons wifes family or guests (eventhough they werent in the living room watching raw with Randy and his wife) so they might as well just say they were production people because its the only thing that makes any sense!
I'm not sure if it was a stunt man or not, but throwing Orton through glass a month before your biggest show of the year might be the dumbest thign they've done in awhile. Take the only major star you have under 30 who ahs any heat, headlining the 25th anniversary of your biggest show, and throw him head first through glass to do an angle.
Zac : i'm pretty sure the Ultimate Warrior was one big allegory for homosexuality and steroid abuse
Lawrence : ODB is really good at what she does. She's basically their Female Austin and much like Raven, Joe, Motor City Machine Guns, AJ and probably 20 other people I'm not thinking of they get over and then they don't pull the trigger.
They have taken the WWF's bimbo division concept to new lows with the Raine Wyldes and the Tayloer Macintoshes or whatever their names are of the world.......
Eric : New lows? That's being totally unfair because you can't even put them in the same league, the women's division was probably the only consistently good thing TNA had last year and shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence as WWE's outside of course of Beth Phoenix. It's like night & day, and TNA's division isn't even close to what it could be!
Lawrence : I guess its a tie with Awesome Kong and Beth Pheonix but they do follow that formula that WWE uses of always taking the belt off the 'it girl' and pushing a new girl every month, regardless of what the fans want. Amazingly the fans love Roxxy Loveaux (sp?) eventhough she's brutal but they still force Taylor Wylde, turn Raka Kahn face and bring in a whole bunch of talentless people. Plus using Daffney as "the governor" is such a waste...
Lawrence : They finally put up Bash at the Beach 2000 (under the name 'Beach Blast', the original name, go figure!) This is one of the most bizarre shows ever. I don't know if you recall but this was dead center in the middle of the new blood thing, probably right after Bischoff left (took a leave?) Russo really is the worst, this show was such a mess......... Here is a small sampling of crash TV gone wrong.
1. Demon Vs Vampiro in a 'graveyard match', which is supposed to end when one of them makes their entrance into the arena ends when Vampiro throws Demon into a casket and the announcers sell it like Warrior/Taker
2. This immediately gets KILLED once they do Hogan Vs Jarret. This could have been really compelling if the announcers don't keep referencing the fact that Russo tried the finish at Havoc and they keep talking about "going off script" while wearing Hawaiin shirts
3. They cut to Vampiro walking back into the arena and he walks right by HOgan ON CAMERA, the belt is being held by some little kid! Either this was supposed to add to the 'realism' or is one of the worst production flaws ever. I think its the second because Hogan doesn't look at all mad or confused and the announcers have to say 'theres the belt!' REALLY poor
4. Vampiro comes back and cuts this promo and they did a druid angle with people in sting masks and 'sting' in a mask (I think it ended up being Demon) beats him with a bat after popping up from the casket. Its a decent angle, especaially because Sting is supposed to be the phantom of the opera now with his scars from the fire jump but the crowd is dead because Jarret just laid down for Hogan.
THEN Russo gives his speech......this man had so many good ideas but the filter needed to be on!
On Nigel McGuinness' wrestling style :
Lawrence : What Nigel did goes way beyond "hardcore" its actually just sickening
and the enjoyment of wrestling for me is that they make it look so real
but noone gets hurt. Like good film makers, actors or magicians. Anything that intentionally puts these guys in harms way to
'entertain' regardless of steroids, strong style, "hardway", its all
I'm watching Cena vs. Michaels from last week right now. How indytastic this match is.
WWE guys always shit on indy workers for their style of match, and how they don't know how to put a match together like the "professionals." I just watched the top 2 babyfaces on RAW do the stalemate/standoff spot, get to the ropes on each others submission finishers, kick out of each others main finishers, etc. Completely formulaic. And not once did either of them really acknowledge the crowd--I felt like I was watching a Christopher Daniels match.
Only thing this match needs now for them to be TOTAL hypocrites is for Cena to superkick Shawn and Shawn to FU Cena, and for both to kick out.
Meh, looks like they didn't go that route, too bad. I wanted to have something else to complain about. Now it's on to Smackdown to see what horrible angle they put Jeff Hardy in last week. Maybe a plane crashed into his locker room? Or a bear ate his dog? Fucking writers.
Lawrence : I finally threw away $7 a month for 24/7 but this month rules. Some stuff to check out:
-Nitro after SS97: I never realized how badly they initially botched the Bret Hart announcement by turning it into an nWo comedy routine. It wasn't terribly offensive except Nash's return gets top billing as one of two big "suprises" and he's laughing and being Alex Shelley the whole time, he's brilliant. Schiavone actually saves the angle by playing up how terrible it would be for the traditionalist to join the nWo. The show itself is AMAZING; Guerrero v Mysterio, Flair v Luger, Hennig v DDP, awesome build to World War 3 and best yet nWo finally beats up Sting. Thats a great way to establish that they will need more baby faces (BRET!) Weirdest thing about the show is seeing heel goldberg with mongos superbowl ring and debra in a video package.
-Goldberg matches galore. The Raven v Goldberg match is so much damn fun, when he jack hammers Reese the place goes from a 10 to a 1,000 in heat. This was Rock v Hogan heat. Compare it to HHH Goldberg, its EMBARSSING how bad that match is and how dead the crowd is. Booker v Goldberg is a disaster and reminds me of how horrible Russo's booking is.
-Orndorff HOF is worth a watch to appreciate how cool Mr. Wonderful was and how he was a change of pace from the "body slamming the fat guy" cliche, a pre cursor to what they did with Savage. His HOF speech is really cool. I never knew he debuted, managed by Piper (in what I assume was Pipers debut) at the same MSG show when Hogan won the belt! HOgan faced him in his first title defense at MSG the next month as well. They REALLY built to Wrestlemania early on. The segment where him and Piper turn on each other is classic early 80's WWF, the brilliant improvising from Piper especially makes it realy work and its fun to see heels implode in a way you can actually care about. If you look at how bland JBL and Orton 'turning on each other' is compared to the heat for Piper, Orndorff and Orton imploding its ridiculous how dry, bland, unemotional and uncharismitic the booking and performances are.
WWE has taken an active stance against MMA, even though Vince McMahon
at least outwardly maintains that they are not in competition. When
running shows in any given arena WWE has, ever since the territorial
wars of the ’80s, made the arenas sign an agreement saying they will
not book a competing event 30 days before or after the show.
Originally, this was aimed at running the likes of Jim Crockett out of
certain key cities. Nowadays it doesn’t really apply to TNA since they
tend to run far smaller venues than WWE does. However, this year WWE
has begun telling the arenas that MMA events also constitute
competition and that they are not allowed to run them 30 days before or
after a WWE show. The Extreme Fight Night group in Alabama has already
had to change dates three times this year due to conflicting schedules
with WWE, although so far as TV is concerned the only promotions WWE
keeps tabs on are TNA and UFC.
Credit: Wrestling Observer Newsletter, 03 July 2008
Lawrence : That may be their paranoid perception but I still propose that MMA poses no
threat to WWE. They could have UFC and WWE back to back every month at MSG and
WWE would still sell out probably quicker and more consistently then UFC. If the
WWE were competition UFC would try and get Carlito to jump ship lol
Eric : If they were to run every month (which they COULDN'T if you read the
article, and I think you'd be underestimating MMA's audience), perhaps
they might sell out 'probably quicker & more consistently' at MSG, but
perhaps you're underestimating MMA's audience. That's another matter,
but the point was they don't try to shut out anyone they DON'T perceive
as competition. I know your argument is that's a perception and not
reality, but, I still say it's related closely enough for their worry
to maybe be warranted. Look at it this way :
If UFC sold out MSG as quicker or consistently as WWE, it would
obviously be because they have two separate audiences generally :
UFC's, or MMA in general's, audience, if comparable to WWE/wrestling,
would be primarily adults, whereas wrestling would be primarily kids.
Both are loyal, but there's a reason UFC director's of marketing calls
a wrestling fan turning to MMA 'graduating.' It could be why WWE's
trying to appeal to kids more now ; to hook them while they're young,
so hopefully they don't eventually mature out of the silly shit they do
& turn to 'the real thing.' It could be why there hasn't been another
'boom' yet (Well, that's mainly wrestling's fault, but anyway...). What
I mean is, according to the cycle theory, we should be on the upswing,
and wrestling has yet to move beyond it's core audience to the
mainstream like it did during the Hogan/WWF 80s era, or the
nWo/Attitude era. Instead, we've seen the rise of MMA, with UFC being
the huge money force, MMA on CBS, coverage in Sports Illustrated/ESPN,
& all of these different (American) groups popping up. That I find very
Lawrence : Its like saying people won't buy The Increible Huld comic book if the movie is
out. Boxing boomed with Tyson in the 80's while WWF boomed w Hogan and boxing as
an overall presentation is much similar to wrestling . Even The tempo and
attention span needed to enjoy boxing is similar to the irish whip pace of
modern wrestling .Nothing about UFC appeals to the average pro wrestling fan
they lack: big budget production, characters that appeal to a variety of
audiences, speed and action at a contemporary americans attention span,
storylines developed beyond the fights themselves, an annual event like
wrstlemania and the superbowl to build around and most imprtantly the inability
to control outcomes to guarantee the audience goes home happy. Apples and
Lawrence : Edge, the OVERATED R, superstar....
On Jeff Hardy's drug suspension before WrestleMania 24 :
Eric : WHAT A FUCKING ASSHOLE!
Rodney : LOL WOOOW. Now this is a career killer
Eric: I couldn't fuckin believe it. Just goes to show nobody learns. And I don't mean that faggot pill head either. I mean the assholes like TNA or WWE who constantly give idiots like this a chance. Let's say he gets taken off tv now (Like he lost the IC belt last night), then he costs the fans him being at WM, and himself another huge payoff(He missed
SummerSlam last year cause of the same bullshit where they had to take the same belt off of him then, AND this is the biggest payoff of the year). But, what if they suspend him after WM, then bring him back & put the belt on him like they did last year with the IC belt? What kind of message does that send? It'd be even WORSE cause then they'd be
giving him THE belt after this shit. This has got to be the final nail on this faggot's coffin. They'd have actually been better off putting the belt on him at
the Rumble, going for my Cena main event at WM, and then even if he does caught suspended, have him do the match at Mania, job the belt, then cut his ass loose. I know I should have probably saved this for the comments under the Roundtable videos but this is too ridiculous not to comment on.
Lawrence : Doesn't suprise me, it'd probably be in his own personal best (not to mention their business) interests to release him forever. They should make a public example of him while they have the world watching at Wrestlemania (in the face of the Benoit stuff) by making some sort of statement about it.
Then again, that would be undone instantly once people see Batista, Cena/HHH and Kennedy go over.
I was thinking about how they have managed to dodge another public bullet from the drive by media with all the bad Benoit publicity by doing the Mayweather thingand McMahon getting a star on the walk of fame. Its almost like they are STRONGER now,
then this sort of stuff happens.
Eric : Doesn't surprise you? You serious? We're a couple weeks away, no one's fucked up like this before on this
Lawrence : My favorite wrestler killing his family and hanging himself definitely
makes it hard for me to be suprised when a career crack head gets
suspended for drugs,lol
Rodney : Well I wouldn't say no one's fucked up on that level. RVD fucked up pretty bad while holding BOTH BELTS!!!!!
Eric : Not just before the biggest show of the year
Rodney : You can't help but laugh at this douche bag. That's what they get for not putting him over at the Rumble.
Lawrence : I don't think it will affect the show or the perception of the show
because of all the other stuff (Mayweather, Taker, Flair retiring).
Eventhough that stuff is artificial, these fans have such a short
attention span its pathetic. Plus Cena wasn't even supposed to be a part of the show as far as fans were concerned until
the Rumble. We all pretty much agreed that they killed Hardy at the
Rumble and his No Way Out "kick out" was smoke and mirrors so if they
weren't planning on doing the awesome angle Eric thought of, him being
out is just as well.
We could even
argue this will add to his mystique if he comes back. Its like the
shoot version of Austin being out before Rumble 98. Its not like marks
care that he's out , they'll just want to see him MORE.